Owned and Operated #89 - Extreme Weather Prep: Optimizing HVAC & Plumbing Operations

Prepare For the Extreme.
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When you work in a weather-enhanced business, there are tons of opportunities when you’re prepared. John and Jack share their game places to make sure operations run smoothly. The extreme temperatures and cold, wet, and windy weather encompass all facets of John's 5 trades: Cold impacts HVAC, wet affects plumbing, drains, and remediation, and wind plays a crucial role in power-related electrical services. This significantly influences how you should be thinking about scheduling, capacity, and your ability to serve your customers.

Episode Hosts: 🎤
John Wilson: @WilsonCompanies on Twitter
Jack Carr: @TheHVACJack on Twitter

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John Wilson, CEO of Wilson Companies

Jack Carr, CEO of Rapid HVAC

Owned and Operated Episode #89 Transcript

If you like what we talk about on our social media, on Twitter, on this podcast, then you should be signed up for our newsletter. Go to ownedandoperated.com where every Friday we break down our business, we break down insights, things we're learning, things we're working on, and it's good stuff. Check it out, ownedandoperated.com.

Today on Owned and Operated, Jack and I talk about preparing for weather. So we are weather enhanced businesses in plumbing, HVAC, and electric. And, next week for both of us, we have some pretty hardcore winter weather coming in. we've got some negatives for four or five days in a row, and some crazy wind.

And that really impacts how we think about scheduling, capacity, and, being able to serve our customers. So, we break it down here. Thanks for tuning in.

Welcome back to Owned and Operated.

Jack Carr: Hey, what's going on, man?

John Wilson: Dude, I'm ready. I'm ready for it. I'm sitting here, cozy. It's a Friday night, the 12th of January. And outside, we have 50 mile an hour winds.

Jack Carr: Yeah, freezing temperatures coming in.

John Wilson: Yeah, and like crazy weather.

Jack Carr: Mhm.

John Wilson: So it started really raining, and then when I left the office, it was a wild snowstorm. So that, it went from raining to like, all of that rain turned into snow, in the span of like 4 or 5 minutes.

Which was just crazy to watch. Big thick flakes, white out, and then the roads have like two inches of slush. Which I assume over the weekend is just going to be pure ice rink

Jack Carr: Ice, ice. Yeah. We get it starting Monday, so it must be moving down. It's hit you guys and then we're like a day and a half away from it. But it rained pretty hard here and then we're supposed to get seven inches of snow on Monday, which for Nashville is wild like they don't we just don't see that

John Wilson: Yeah. That's going to be fun

Jack Carr: I'm excited.

I love snow

John Wilson: Yeah, man. Before we dive into this episode we're gonna talk about the workshop that we've been working on, which has been pretty cool. So we have that workshop coming up March 19th through the 21st

Jack Carr: 21st. Yep

John Wilson: Up in Northeast Ohio at my location.

It's going to be a lot of fun. What's been really cool so far, like talking to people, I think there's 17 people signed up as of today which is like, I think a good group for something that we were just like randomly like, Hey, let's get, let's do this.

Jack Carr: I'm so excited

John Wilson: It's going to be cool. A lot of different business types. So we've got some B2B, we've got some B2C Yeah, some plumbing and HVAC and some, I think there's some roofing. There's a few business types, but a lot of the stuff that we're going to be talking about is basically the same, like how do you build field team leaders?

How do you hire salespeople? How do you get leads? There's going to be difference obviously between businesses and homeowners, but it's going to be good content. So yeah, I'm starting to get pumped. We're starting to like work through curriculum and design the event.

Jack Carr: Yeah, I have a question for you about that. So this is a loaded question, but I was talking to someone today who's in the process of buying a home service business and they were thinking about coming and I said, yeah, it would, it behoove you to, to hit the ground running with a lot of these topics and behind the scene knowledge, but they were worried that, it's too soon.

What's your feeling on that?

John Wilson: You know I could go either way I could go either way, I think if it were me, so like the danger is that you can't contain yourself and you change too much too soon. So like, you know how it should be, because you attend this awesome workshop that tells you exactly what you should do

Jack Carr: Yeah.

John Wilson: So you know how it should be, so then you get into a place where it's likely not that way, and you get tempted to change.

So that's the danger. The positive side is that business probably needs a pretty good kick in the teeth. Like I think I've shared in this show before Buying it, I don't think, and I'm open to being wrong or disproven or whatever, but I don't think you can buy a trades business and do no harm for the average human. So if somebody bought us tomorrow, they should walk into that with a do no harm philosophy. We've got a lot of stuff going on. It's 140 people. People understand their roles. And it's working. Like, that's not something you're going to go in and make a big mess out of. If you buy a sub five million dollar shop, you already assume it's a mess.

Nobody has any actual idea what they're doing. They don't have any professionalized lead flow. The managers are, like, probably doing, like, a quarter of what they're supposed to be doing. You sort of have to make a mess.

Jack Carr: Eventually. Yes. There's a don't change too much, too fast facet. It mainly revolves around employees, but at the end of the day, I don't think it's still changes what you need to know in the long run. Like we knew we needed a comfort advisor system versus a tech a sales tech model.

We didn't do that for three, four months, but actually we didn't do that for probably a year, almost a year, but we still did it in the long run because we knew that's the correct thing to do because I'm involved in this on the daily. And so I told this individual, I said, honestly, as long as you go into that, knowing it um, that don't go in there and just destroy the whole company because you'll lose all your employees and you'll, keep the culture, feel it out and then start implementing the easiest parts and get the ball rolling.

But I still think it's a good value to have that

John Wilson: I think so too. I think like, when you're buying these small businesses, what's the quick win? What's the thing that you can do that's not going to cause a massive cultural disruption, but can drive growth in the business quickly? Maybe that's, like, lead flow. You're not going to disrupt anybody's life knowing how to drive more lead flow. You're not going to disrupt anybody's life learning how to book phone calls better. Maybe you get a little bit of information on how to work better with your service managers. That'll disrupt a little bit, I think just like anything, come with questions. Or ideally come with one question, but like one to three, like, what's the big problem in my business?

How do I solve it? And you can do that, like, if the big problem is I'm new to this business and I just need a kind of a rough roadmap for the next twelve months, this could be that.

Jack Carr: That's going to be the big part. And then I know we're going to touch on acquisitions and tuck ins and add ons and all this kind of stuff as well. That's all applicable too. So if you are in that stage and you're thinking about potentially coming.

You're under LOI, maybe you're starting to work on drafts of APA, I'd say do it. I think we've all been there and I wish I had this looking back at that point.

John Wilson: Yeah, gives clarity. I think that's what this is all about. I was just on a show, Millennial Investing, the other day, and he asked, like, you know, most of our time that we talked was about my actual job, and then he's like, so what are you doing over there with Owned and Operated and this workshop thing, and I'm like here's what we're doing, like, I wish I had this information, and, when I was two, three, four million dollars a year, like that would have been super helpful.

It would have shortened my learning curve. And like when I was doing this, when I was that size, I didn't really know anyone else in the industry. And Twitter was a really big unlock for me, just meeting other people that were doing this. Like I had never met another person buying plumbing at HVAC companies.

And by the time I joined Twitter, I'd already been doing it for five years. Like, that was it. As far as I knew, this was like, the weirdest thing in the world that this was happening. And then I get on Twitter, and it's like, the coolest thing ever to people on Twitter

Jack Carr: That's so wild to me still to this day

John Wilson: Yeah. Like, I

Jack Carr: That you bought businesses before anyone, like you didn't have any help. I don't know where I would be without this community. Seriously, first off, I wouldn't have bought a business. Second off, Like everything, all my playbooks, every single one of my playbooks, for purchasing businesses and running businesses, comes from Twitter.

That's who I surround myself with. I posted a couple days ago about how great Rand was. Shout out to Rand for helping me out with, just like, we understand that you don't have those people surrounding you to talk to. And so this is a good unlock to, to really get face to face time with people and also see John's shop, which I'm super excited for. I'm so excited for your shop.

John Wilson: The timing is intentional, right? So by the time we get to it, like VMI will be done, fully implemented, done. It's about a four month process.

Jack Carr: VMI for anyone listening is Vendor Managed Inventory.

John Wilson: Yeah. So we got large enough that a wholesaler.

Partnered with us, basically, and launched a branch inside the back of our building.

Jack Carr: A shop inside a shop.

John Wilson: A shop inside a shop, of which we are the only customer. Yeah.

Jack Carr: I love that so much.

John Wilson: They're awesome. Like, they've been a really awesome partner in this. It's exciting for both of us.

Jack Carr: Sweet, man. Yeah. March 19th to the 21st.

John Wilson: Yeah, check out ownedandoperated.com for more dates. Feel free to DM me on Twitter too.

Hey, this episode is sponsored by Service Scalers. So Service Scalers is actually a brand that I've used personally with our companies for a little bit over a year now. They've helped us manage our digital advertising. Frankly, they did a lot better than our last agency. Leads went through the roof and cost per click went way down.

Check out Service Scalers if you're a plumbing, HVAC, or electrical home service company. That's what they knock out of the park and they did a great job for me.

Jack Carr: Circling back to the weather, I know this is my second winter. We have done some newbie, newbie second HVAC winter last year, we had a negative seven and we had over 250 calls in three hours, which is, I know that's for you. That's like your six hour window, but for us, it was more calls than like three or four months back then.

We were doing 800, 000 a year,

John Wilson: That's huge volume.

Jack Carr: It was unmanageable volume. Like we didn't. We just stopped answering the phones, our schedule was booked. And so this year we're going into it with some SOPs, and we're trying to prepare. I don't know if how well we're going to do, we'll see.

But I'm curious as to, what is preparing for a big storm like this look like for you?

John Wilson: So I cracked a joke earlier today, because this is a perfect blend of everything that we like. It's cold. It's wet, It's windy. So like, that's all five of my trades. Cold, wet, and windy. That's my type of day. So cold's obviously going to hit HVAC, wet's going to hit plumbing, drains, remediation, and windy's going to help with power.

Jack Carr: Yeah.

John Wilson: We're impacted on all five fronts over the next seven days. Obviously it impacts us in a number of ways. On call is one of them.

Jack Carr: Mhmm.

John Wilson: Namely, we don't have an on call. So how do we think about, the 55 mile an hour wind started today at 4 p. m. So on call how do we think about schedule as we prepare for sort of an onslaught of weather? How do we think about lead flow? And,

Jack Carr: How do you prepare for that too because you have this week that you've probably been preparing to knock out like a lot of these No, for at least for us, like we had customers sitting. Maybe we can push them a little bit, we can push them a little bit, like they were waiting on a board install.

You can't wait on a board install anymore, right? No, electric heat's not going to cut it. There's a perfect preparation too in that schedule, right?

John Wilson: Yep. On call, schedule prep, and capacity. How are we going to think about capacity? Those are the three big ways that we think about this. And, I'll say for anyone listening, this is our first time, I'd say, being as roughly prepared as I think we're going to be. And it's really like, I think it's a team maturity thing. The team is starting to really fire on all cylinders together. Which, I can like, barely explain how cool that is. To have like, fully loaded departments actually working. I don't know. Sometimes I’m just like pinch me, like our marketing team has like eight people now and like that seven months ago I didn't have a marketing team and now they're driving very real results for our business.

It's just crazy. So we had to sort of get like full company alignment around how we're going to handle this. So we have full company alignment around every day. Every day we're going to come in and we're going to run this many calls. We're going to aim at this much revenue. Our average ticket is going to be this.

Our conversion is going to be this. We're going to expect to sell this many clubs, this many reviews. And we're going to know that we're going to set up tomorrow for success. That's we're on alignment now, and for the most part, that's great, until it comes to weather. In extreme weather events, we're a weather enhanced business, so we have to change the rules a little bit.

So the first one's on call. We don't have on call. We have optional on call, basically. So we have some guys that work on the weekends. They take calls if they want them, essentially like water heaters, or

Jack Carr: Items that are worth going out for.

John Wilson: Pretty much, so like we've done two to five water heaters a weekend for a year and a half, so we always have done them that's really what alerted us to launching weekends And now we have people on shifts on the weekends too, but it's not gonna be enough this weekend. So we basically opened it up and said like, hey, we're gonna have some no powers. We're gonna have some no heats. We're gonna have some no hot waters if you want it, come get it. Now, we have to set them up, we have to build capacity inside ServiceTitan, we have to make sure that our call center knows that they're available.

This isn't like, yeah, Jimmy's, you know,

Jack Carr: Half in, half out yeah. But it's optional.

John Wilson: It's optional.

Jack Carr: Still optional. I told everyone I said mandatory on call

John Wilson: Well. See, it's optional, but the company's big enough that someone's gonna take it. Like, hey, do you want 20 grand of sales for the weekend?

Jack Carr: I guess the better question is like on your average team size, say, different teams, each area, how many of them took you up on that


John Wilson: No, we only needed one or two above the shift.

Jack Carr: Okay.

John Wilson: So we have like, seven people working this weekend. It's not that much, like, compared to total headcount. It's not that much. And we're also in a weird time where, like, I've talked about this on the show, but we're launching weekends. That's taken every bit of 45 days for us. You know, we're multi trade, multi discipline. It's not like we're just plumbing or just HVAC where I can just, like, load guys down. Like, I have to get two electricians, I have to get two HVAC, two plumbers. Then you have to get a call center, then you have to get dispatch. It's a 12 to 15 person hiring round to fill this out, it'll take 90 days from start of the idea back in November to completion in February.

So yeah, so we opened it up so we got everyone, we trained we opened up their capacity on ServiceTitan which is just like, yes, you can schedule for them. And then we taught our call center, the after hours and the weekend call center, how to schedule on them and, what priorities they could put on those technicians. So that's the first big one, is literally do you have the people to do it, or on the weekend.

Weekday, we'll talk about that. The second one is the schedule. We had to get a little bit more choosy about the schedule. So we have a tool that we use called the three day call board. Have we ever talked about this?

Yeah. It's not very complicated, but it did change our business for the better in September when we first started using the 3 day call board. So we didn't make it up it's a, from a group that we're a part of called Nexstar. And the three day call board is before you leave, at the end of every day, tomorrow has to have three calls on every tech, the next day has to have two, and the following day has to have one.

And the idea is that you take full accountability and ownership over your team's schedule being full. Which was something that I think most businesses don't do. I know that we didn't.

Jack Carr: We didn't as well until we started doing it.

John Wilson: It's a game changer. And just like anything else that I've implemented over the past year, cause we've put in some real, like stuff that I wish we knew at 5 million, but instead we're figuring out at 25 million, I feel sincerely bad for everyone that we compete against.

Because we are figuring out, like, building block 101 stuff, and we're already bigger than all of them. I don't know, it's gonna be really entertaining. But 3 day call board's a big deal. Now we have to think about, okay, instead of the expected, let's say, 800 total calls, so maybe, like, 400 inbounds, or 500 whatever it's gonna be for Monday, it's gonna be 5 degrees.

So we should expect a thousand inbounds. Which our call center does have the capacity to handle. We could probably handle up to fourteen hundred or something a day. That would be a lot. That would like, full tilt.

Yeah, you're talking on the toilet type of, you know, environment. Most days between inbounds and outbounds, eight to nine hundred is sort of where we fall. So we could bounce up fifty percent. But we have to think about how we're going to think about 3 day call board because we know that those calls are going to come in and we don't want to over have to reschedule too much. Typically on a day to day basis, we want to schedule 110 percent of capacity because we know that we're going to have some cancellations.

So we always overbook intentionally. It's a big part of the dispatching process.

We should touch

Jack Carr: on that in a different episode because that's interesting. We're just starting to run into that messing with our business. And I know this a side note

John Wilson: We run 140 opportunities a day. 20 cancellations a day is very normal for us. 14, 15 percent.

Jack Carr: Wow. Yeah, see, we're just starting to like the problems just starting. I can feel the wheels turning behind it. Like we get maybe three I'm

John Wilson: Yeah, so you gotta man, that a percent.

Jack Carr: Yeah, which I mean, three on three techs at five. So three on 20 calls a day.

John Wilson: 15 percent. yeah. So 10-15 percent I think is pretty normal. Cancellations could be anything. Like, hey, I got sick. Hey, I had to go to work. Hey, whatever. Or like, I found somebody else to do it faster. So there's any number of reasons, when the number gets bigger, It does get harder to refill that.

Jack Carr: So let me ask you a question about the three day call board. Especially in this scenario, right? So you're going to have an increase in calls, right? Your capacity will be capped at some point. At any point, do you triage those calls or does your inbound team your call center triage any of those calls coming in? to kick them down. Do they qualify them in any way, shape or form? What does that look like?

Or are they just kind of saying no heat and then

John Wilson: It's by priority Next week, we're not gonna run very much besides P1s and P2s. Yeah. We're not gonna come out and do P4s. So if a P4 comes in, we'll shove it out into the following week.

Jack Carr: Do you guys have an issue with, so especially in that negative degree temperature, I don't know what, how. I mean, with the changing landscape of today's society we get a lot of more heat pumps are showing up and anybody in HVAC knows once you drop below like 20 degrees heat pumps just don't work.

We last year got a ton of heat pump calls where we show up and I mean we had what, like I said, maybe 12, 12 call capacity and then we'd say, Hey, it's a heat pump. And then you're onto the next one. Do they try to filter any of those out? Do they have like a temperature set point? Unless your house is under 62 degrees, we're not coming out type of deal.

Is there anything system in place

John Wilson: Uh, W e don't currently We don't. So like our HVAC team we have the capacity every day for 28 opportunities in service

Jack Carr: Mm

John Wilson: So what's that, 140 138 throughout the course of a week. So what we're gonna do is we're gonna bump that up. I think we're gonna go up to 40 a day.

Because we'll fill it. So every text is going to take an additional two. And so we're just going to expect to have capacity. That's

Jack Carr: And filter out those quick calls. Like, hey, I can get to the next one.

John Wilson: Pretty much. Yeah, so our texts have been, that was the next one. The third one is like capacity in and of itself. Can you stretch it?

You can. For HVAC, this is the game, like, hey, it's game time, it's game week, it's zero degrees, it's negatives, like, yeah, this is gonna be it.

You guys don't have on call, you have a great situation here, you're gonna work extra this week.

Jack Carr: Yeah. That's what we did is like I was saying. It's interesting. So we've hit all three of those. We, on schedule we went ahead and we on call. We went ahead and we made all of our, everyone else on call. We just have to, we're so small that, the volume that's going to come in, we need the extra help.

Service managers on call, even I'm on call. We've talked about four, I've ran the four hour run again. Then we move into scheduling. We're stretching like yourself in capacity. We're cutting the three day call board and we moved all the maintenances out, moved all the non essentials like duct cleanings out, passed that time frame and then the last bit that we did is, which I'm curious if your team has done anything like this, ordering.

We did like a special order. We made VMI. We ordered extra gas valves, pressure switches, everything. We restocked all the trucks. We stocked all the trucks with some temporary heaters, four temporary heaters each truck. So that if there was a part out or something that we can lend a heater. Do you guys lend heaters?

John Wilson: We do. And we were not as dedicated about parts as you were. We should have been.

Jack Carr: Yeah I think mine comes from trauma from last year. Negative seven, man. It is cold. My ears. I got a big old bald head. It freezes out there.

But still, we run into boards and things that we just can't fix on site. So we drop heaters for people and then try to get back to them that week.

It will be interesting though, because last week, last year kind of did a V for us. It's like 20, negative 7, 15, 20 again. This week, this one looks like it's going to be negative. 2 0 0 8, so it's like, it's stretched this

John Wilson: Yeah.

Jack Carr: year, so it'll be interesting.

John Wilson: Yeah, I mean, it more freezes.

Jack Carr: Yeah, and we're plumbing this year, so I have no idea.

I called my plumber freaking out, saying, can you please get everything in line for this, because I don't know what I don't know.

John Wilson: Yeah.

it's a lot of frozen pipes, it's a lot of water heaters.

So just like pilots go out on these 20 year old water heaters with high winds. So you're going to see a ton of it.

Jack Carr: So excited.

John Wilson: It's fun. It is going to be interesting. But the team really rallied going into the weekend. And everyone's excited and ready to serve our customers. We're

Jack Carr: Neat. Is there anything I'm missing? Any systems I can put into place or

John Wilson: I mean call center. Like how do you literally handle more calls?


Jack Carr: Yeah.


John Wilson: going to be the big one.

Jack Carr: Yeah we've already fired and hired. Speaking of call center for anyone, John and my ongoing joke is the 90 day call center flip. He said, Jack, you need to always be hiring for call center. And I am now always hiring for call center because we had one, we brought someone in for three weeks, it didn't work out.

We already had someone ready to go from previous interviews who just started again. Because of the 90 day call center flip rule. Man, I just want my Bertha or my Betty who's been there 20 years, why can't I get a few of those? But

John Wilson: We'll see the problem is that those are terrible at their job. So like you have to have absolutely zero accountability and then

Jack Carr: Then I can have

John Wilson: Then You can have a 20 year employee who will walk all over you every day, that's right

Jack Carr: They're all working the same OT

John Wilson: Yeah

Jack Carr: We stretched the hours. So we have like a nighttime CSR and a daytime CSR dispatcher

Both hours are they're on eights that overlap slightly that overlap is bigger to a 10 hour schedule so that during those times they can both flex

John Wilson: Sounds like you guys are ready to roll

Jack Carr: We're going to run it.

My true only worry is that at the end of the day, all of our employees because of the areas that we live in is a very affluent area. Most of the employees live about 30, 45 minutes out. So my, my big worry going into this year is road conditions and two wheel drive vans, and I don't know how we're going to.We'll see how that goes.

How do you handle that?

John Wilson: Not it depends on the year

We've had a couple weird snowstorms in the past few years where we've shut the business down . Which is like nowadays that's a hundred thousand dollars

Jack Carr: Yeah.

John Wilson: That's so much money So it's real hard to make that decision. Yeah. Cause like everyday is a hundred grand. I really don't know. It's like you pray it doesn't happen, but like last year, we got 18 inches overnight.

So like, we would have spent more in tow trucks than we would have made.

Jack Carr: So that's where our hope is that they say seven, we get one and that we can actually, you know, get there and do it, but we shall

John Wilson: It's a hard thing to stomach.

Jack Carr: What do you do with the phone lines? Do you just shut them down or what's that procedure look like when you do?

They work remote, they take calls, they say, hey, we're not, we can't get any text on the road due to the snow.

John Wilson: Yep.

Jack Carr: Sorry.

John Wilson: Yeah, but so like, in our defense for these days that I'm referencing, the entire city shut down.

Jack Carr: Yeah,

John Wilson: We weren't equipped. The city wasn't equipped to get 18 inches. It actually turned into, like, a whole thing. Because they had these contracts to clean the highways before they cleaned the city streets.

The city completely shut down. No one could do anything. For multiple days. Because they weren't bothering to touch the streets. They were only doing the highways. It became like a whole drama.

Jack Carr: Sweet.

John Wilson: Yep. Alright so, we are weather enhanced so we adjust our on call, we mess with our 3 day call board to make sure that we have open schedule, and we increase our available capacity per day to handle the increased load.

Jack Carr: And prepare parts.

John Wilson: Oh, and prepare parts. We didn't do that very well this year but

Jack Carr: You have a VMI. If you need gas valves, they're in your shop. Like you have to go buy them.

They're not on the trucks, but they're there for us. It's like 30 minutes, 45 minutes up a highway in those conditions to go grab 'em.

Not to cut you some slack. You're welcome either way

John Wilson: Thank you. Thank you. But yeah, so those are the big ones. Look, as this comes out, try to kill it. That December of 22, like negative 7 thing, that kept businesses busy through the end of January.

Jack Carr: I bet we did remediation work, lots of remediation work where pipes busted in people's houses and they need all new HVAC. We probably have four jobs

John Wilson: Oh yeah, it's a thing.

This type of weather is, it's perfect timing for us because February will usually slow down. So this is going to keep us rolling into February.

Jack Carr: That's what I told the team and so that's why they're all cool with on call and let's do it. I'm excited. We'll keep everyone updated and maybe we'll come back after in two weeks and touch on this. Horror stories.

John Wilson: I want to just share numbers. I want to be like, here's our calls. Here's actually what happened. Like if we break, it's not many days that we break a thousand calls a day. We're roughly at like three to four thousand a week, depending on the week. It's kind of weird because we've had holidays for the past couple weeks. But like five thousand a week would be That'd be a good time.

Jack Carr: My yearly call volume.

John Wilson: Yeah, I mean, calls

Jack Carr: no, I know I'm messing around, but,

John Wilson: calls.

Jack Carr: yeah we'll, we can share some of those stats now that we can actually track them better to a service Titan this year. We didn't have them last year, so we'll actually be able to see that incoming flow and run those reports, which will be exciting.

John Wilson: Heck Yeah.

Jack Carr: Yeah. We'll touch them on the backend.

John Wilson: Cool. Alright, everybody stay warm serving customers. Thanks for tuning in.

Thanks for tuning in to Owned and Operated, the podcast for home service entrepreneurs. If you enjoyed today's episode, please hit the like button and subscribe to the podcast. If you have any questions or topics you'd like us to cover, feel free to reach out. You can find me on Twitter at at Wilson companies.

I'll see you next time.

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